Curse

Abedeus · Jan 09, 2010, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reverend Dr

People really don't know what they want in a video game. They may think they know, but they don't. They will go as far as to tell and scream about what they think they want, when it isn't what they really want.

I do. I want the game I bought in 2005. Not saying they should revert the updates, that would be stupid. I want the "skill>time" and not "one skillbar + consumables > time > skill" as it is now.

QueenofDeath · Jan 10, 2010, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Quote:

Someone told me that I need rank 10, or I can't get into groups. It wasn't my choice. I get no reward...

This is where you failed as you believe too much of what "someone" told you. It wasn't 100% so. Just because someone says jump off a cliff would you do it?

) I got into groups just fine without even having Ursans. If you're a crowd follower then yeah you HAVE to do what OTHERS say not what the game requires or allows. If you're part of the speed clear group then yep you have to follow that crowd and build but there is nothing in the game requiring those builds. Players used them because they are lemmings instead of role playing gamers.

PuppyEater · Jan 10, 2010, 02:28 AM // 02:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by animal fighter

first off,
no grind is necessary in gw. at all. period.

you grind for flashy armor/expensive weapons to make your character look better
but they are by no means necessary

so all grind is by choice

My tyrian made ranger in elona begs to differ...

AKB48 · Jan 10, 2010, 06:15 AM // 06:15

We grind because it's really is one of the core ideas MMOs are build around. you create a character, then what do you do? stuff, like quests and missions. however, quests and missions are usually a bad place to get that flashy sword you always wanted, so what do you do? any idiot then knows to kill ONLY the monster(s) that drop that flashy sword, since that or kill monsters with a good cash dropping rate gives the player the fastest possible time to get that sword. Why were UW sc so popular? since it provided a too fast output of ectos, which the current gw society uses as an add for any item over the price of 100k. So many people can get the items they want in less the time. we grind because we want stuff fast, we want items hot, and we want them N-O-W.

We humans are a race that hates waiting, though we do praise patience as a virtue.(lol what a bunch of hypocrites we are)

Motoko · Jan 10, 2010, 08:39 AM // 08:39

Why do we hate lung cancer but love smoking cigarettes?

fenix · Jan 10, 2010, 08:53 AM // 08:53

One might simply say that 'grind is required, farming is not', which would explain the hatred for grind.

That is slightly incorrect in Guild Wars, where there is little to no grind required. The MAIN reason people hate grind but not farming, is because;

Grinding gets you;
- titles
- fancy armor

Farming gets you;
- extra cash

People prefer farming because they get something out of it (money) but hate grind because they 'have' to do it in order to get their flashy stuff.

N1ghtstalker · Jan 10, 2010, 12:18 PM // 12:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gladiator Motoko

Why do we hate lung cancer but love smoking cigarettes?

cuz i rather die happily instead of living a boring life without having fun

Ariovist Lynxkind · Jan 10, 2010, 08:18 PM // 20:18

I think the problem is the type of grind. Farming is choice, where as the other types of grinds, the ones people hate like having to make X level to enter Y area and spending Z days doing so, are forced on us.

It is surprisingly easy to make gold just by wandering around, killing stuff, so to go out and farm to make the same amount in a short time is a choice, which is why it is more accepted.

Well, that's just how I see it anyway

agrios · Jan 11, 2010, 12:06 AM // 00:06

Farming is always optional.

But having to kill the same mob gazillions of times for some time just to get to the next level, a.k.a grinding, its f*'in stupid.

Risus · Jan 11, 2010, 01:15 AM // 01:15

The loot system is set up perfectly at the moment. There is no way to exploit it, no way to cheat it, only hope for a good drop. I personally know EXACTLY how it works, which I would not like to reveal as its some pretty controversial information (which would completely kill any current "theories" on the system). I can, however, PROVE to you I know how it works with a pretty mindblowing demonstration (just PM me in game Risus the Assassin, I have to use items which I have a low stock of and are quite hard to get, therefore I charge 20k if you want me to prove it, not a scam btw u can screen and send to ANet if it is). Back on topic, the drop system is fine and sturdy, you shouldn't be guranteed a rare item after a certain amount of time because then its not a rare item. Prices are based on rarity, rarity is based on the chances of it dropping, a guranteed drop means rarity goes down which means prices goes down which means more crying about how its too cheap now that you finally got one to drop for you.

Clone · Jan 11, 2010, 03:43 AM // 03:43

First, I think there's a group that would say they aren't a fan of either. I'm certianly in that group.

Second, I think part of the difference comes from how much Anet is doing to goad you in a certian direction. They sometimes nerf farming activity. Though, their behavior here isn't all that consistent, leaving some forms of farming untouched for long times. Either way, there's never been a sigificant thrust by Anet to make you fill your storage box with ecto. Most things purchased from NPCs are fairly reasonable, leaving a small market of super-rare pricey stuff, only different from the normal stuff in skins, not stats.

The stance on grind seem much clearer: Anet is all for it. Eye of the North gave you a big empty room to fill up with titles from your grinding glory, and makes sure you go through that room a number of times in completeing that story, giving you a sense that you can be behind the pack in Guild Wars 2 long before it even comes out.

Zahr Dalsk · Jan 11, 2010, 04:15 AM // 04:15

I wasn't aware there were people who thought grind and farming were separate.

Zodiac Meteor · Jan 11, 2010, 04:57 AM // 04:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

I wasn't aware there were people who thought grind and farming were separate.

They are separate.

Grinding = Required to continue
Farming = Cash and exotic items

You grind to get stronger, beat tougher foes in PvE and PvP.
You farm to get fame and respect, more time means more skill.

Why else would you buy the Chaos Gloves, Voltaic Spear, Obby Armor? It's not because they are stronger.

This is why I love Guild Wars, you don't have to murder 1,000 small animals to get to the next level in order to kill a powerful boss.

Shasgaliel · Jan 11, 2010, 12:10 PM // 12:10

I still not see where are these places where people are forced to grind in gw. Even these 10k kurzick/luxon can be obtained by doing quests on the way without any need to repeat anything same with ss points. People want a title it is THEIR choice to do some work and get it. They repeat stuff for money and they repeat stuff for title. If they want to do a title and ways to do it are not fun sorry just do something else there is really no obligation to get the titles... Remove titles then "grind" is over.....

killerbot3009 · Jan 11, 2010, 12:19 PM // 12:19

tbh i enjoy grinding titles, its more fun to grind titles than it is to fail UW with some noob Pugs.

qvtkc · Jan 11, 2010, 12:58 PM // 12:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gladiator Motoko

Why do we hate lung cancer but love smoking cigarettes?

Exactly this.

Grind is something that is forced upon you. Farming is something you (in this case) choose to do.

tmakinen · Jan 11, 2010, 01:08 PM // 13:08

I would tend to define grind as 'a tedious task that you must do repeatedly in order to be able to do what you actually would want to do'. Pretty much anything can be grind if you are goal oriented and only do things with the end reward in mind. Conversely, nothing is grind as long as you genuinely enjoy what you are currently doing.

When I farm, it's like fishing - an enjoyable activity in itself (and if you wonder, the value is in having an excuse to not do much anything at all) and not a means to achieve anything in particular, so it's not grind. Another player farming the very same spot may only do it with the sole intention of getting the required amount of cash/ecto for a pair of chaos gloves to show off at Kamadan, and will find it a hideous grind.

Since 'we' are not a hive mind, there's more than enough room for all kinds of contradictory opinions.

Zahr Dalsk · Jan 11, 2010, 01:17 PM // 13:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor

They are separate.

Grinding = Required to continue
Farming = Cash and exotic items

Grind is the process of repeating a boring action continually for some form of personal gain.

Farming is the process of repeating a boring action continually for some form of personal gain.

You don't NEED to complete rep titles, for example, to continue. They aren't required. But they sure as hell are grind. They're also farming!

qvtkc · Jan 11, 2010, 01:53 PM // 13:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk

Grind is the process of repeating a boring action continually for some form of personal gain.

Farming is the process of repeating a boring action continually for some form of personal gain.

You don't NEED to complete rep titles, for example, to continue. They aren't required. But they sure as hell are grind. They're also farming!

lol

Is farming grind? Sure it is, but it's not forced upon you. You can choose to farm, or you can choose to not farm and still be successful in the game, at least insofar that completion of a piece of content depends on your personal skill just as much as it does for a guy who farms 5 hours per day (at least almost, admittedly, rep titles matter a little bit).

If on the other hand you define success as being able to prance around Kamadan dressed in your FoW armor whilst being followed around by the newest most expensive minipet, then yes, you are forced to farm.

ne33us · Jan 11, 2010, 01:56 PM // 13:56

My versions of what is Grinding / Farming

Grinding.
It is the process to level up a character when the (bad designed) game doesn't give the player alternative ways to enjoy the game's storyline while leveling up.
So, NO CHOICE for the player here.

Farming.
It is the process to achive objectives other than leveling up.
Those objectives are usually not related with the game's storyline, they are optional, so the player has the CHOICE to either farm or not.